On Wednesday, I shared how I reckon some blokes think asking for help is the same as complaining, and how that may contribute to why they choose to suffer in silence.
I also wrote about how sharing my challenges is my attempt to normalise struggle, in hope that it will make others feel ok about theirs and ask for help.
But I'm interested to know what you think about this approach.
Do you think people compare asking for help to complaining? And if so, why?
And what else can we do to make blokes feel ok to ask for help?
I don't know if I think they do. I think that it can sometimes be perceived as a sign of weakness, when being open with feelings should be a sign of strength. Once we break this stigma and people feel comfortable enough to be vulnerable it will be a game changer.
One thought I've had is that as our world gets better and better, we have less reason to have sympathy for ourselves. Particularly here in Australia where life is incredible compared to most other places.
Ultimately, compared to the 100bn people who've lived before us and the 8bn people on the planet today, we are about as lucky as they come... so voicing our struggle doesn't feel right against the backdrop of other struggles.
But surely we need to start viewing our struggles as relative to us. The hardest thing we've been through is the hardest thing we've been through and just because Nelson Mandela spent decades in a prison cell, doesn't mean we don't get to let off some steam about a rough day's work.
We should strive for stoicism but when the pressure gets too much, do we need a way to let off some steam?
I recently read a book called: If I'm so wonderful, Why am I still single by Susan Page. Written in 1986.
The opening page of chapter one, blew me away. I will type it below....
Introduction
The Great Emotional Depression
Finding Love in an unloving world.
Mother Teresa commented that the United States was the most loveless country she'd ever visited. I won't presume to say what she might have meant, but the statement hit home with me, for I have long experienced this culture as loveless. The West's preoccupation with money and consumerism seems to me far more dominant an influence in our lives than our desire for pleasurable human relationships. We say we seek love and belonging, but we spend far more time and energy acquiring money and the things it buys. Love is an extracurricular activity - relegated to odd moments outside the working day.
The real problem is the extent to which love and work are incompatible activities. Too often, time spent on one is time unavailable to the other. Worse. love and work require opposite types of behaviour. For example, to succeed in the 'marketplace', you have to be competitive, 'businesslike', wary of others, and committed above all else to the bottom line. To succeed in an intimate relationship, you need to be co-operative, flexible, emotionally available, honest and committed above all else to the welfare of your loved one. Such different skills are required for love and work that it is difficult to be good at both of them. And when society values visble affluence as much as ours does, most people are going to spend their energy becoming good at work. Love takes a back seat.....
I don't think the above just applies to romantic relationships and this book isn't just for those who are single. We are so focused on our careers and money (and the rising costs of living do not help with this) that while we care about our friends and family, we often don't have the time to really listen to them.
It's the listening and the validating of the human experience that makes the biggest difference.
Mate, I don't know the solution to the issue, if I did, I would no doubt be very wealthy off the back of that knowledge. But my own experience will hopefully flesh out the encyclopaedia of thoughts, approaches, and accounts you no doubt have offered up to you.
My own issues with depression and struggling in life I only ever discuss once I feel a bit better, when I am a bit lost, I close off and do not talk about it, when I feel better, I start addressing my depression in a bit more of a "review what happened" kind of thing. It is almost like I need to start feeling better before I talk about it, and perhaps that is the tricky bit, how do you dig yourself out of a hole? That will differ for each and every person. For me, I accept that depression will never be completely a non-issue. Although I do feel like I am building a tool set as to how I deal with it and for me it is important that I deal with it quietly, by taking control of my thoughts and forcing myself to get more sleep, get more exercise, drink a little less, and accept that it may be months until I start to feel in control again.
But your approach, is a tool in my approach, I may not engage with your commentary often, but it is still helping, I process my own depression quietly, but still read things like your articles, I still need others being vocal to help reassure myself that the goal is within reach still.
So even if you are doubting your approach, or opinion, you are right, having people talk openly about their struggles, does help those that don't take that approach themselves.
Hi Ben I think it’s a great approach to pose a question. I am not a man (obviously!) but I am a mother of a son. I know whereas my daughter is constantly verbalising about where she is at and how she feels - I observe the conflict in men as they must be strong and so knowing what vulnerability is and validating an emotional state and then to ask for help are often seen as enormous actions. Yes yes keep normalising how you feel or felt and most importantly how you sat with discomfort and what actions or steps - as small as they are - you took. How did it feel. And lastly how are you Ben and what is on your mind? :)
Aug 18, 2022·edited Aug 18, 2022Liked by Ben Alexander
Yes it could be seen/heard as complaining as there is a fine line between a whinge and genuine issue, especially if people don't know the individuals circumstances. Furthermore being reliable is a desirable trait in men and women, especially in a professional environment, so people are reluctant to be seen as otherwise, even if they are actually battling. Plenty of stories of people who took on too much without thinking it through. I think key is trying not to put yourself in a place where you will be out of your depth and vulnerable to unforseen challenges. Of course this not always possible so you still need a confidant you can talk to in the first instance. Talk to through with them and get a fresh perspective. Then decide how best to deal with it. It would be naive, unfortunately, to think society is educated enough at present that one could be so open an honest about struggling without some stigma.
Just throwing in that it’s not only blokes who find it difficult to ask for help or admit that they’re struggling. Many women do too. Anyone who’s ever prided themselves on being strong and resilient (or is perceived as such by others) is more likely to see it as a sign of weakness if they shatter that illusion. Or if you’re the one that everyone else confides in, maybe you feel that you have to be strong all the time to be the ‘rock’ that family and friends depend on. Also, some people just don’t have anyone close enough to confide in and don’t feel comfortable talking to strangers.
Perhaps people need help to identify a request for help, so they don't brush it off: "oh, you're fine!" "Plenty of people worse off than you!" and instead sit with them and actively listen. I think GPs are an under-utilised resource here. They can listen and refer without taking on the emotional element that disclosure to family or close friends could generate.
I don't know if I think they do. I think that it can sometimes be perceived as a sign of weakness, when being open with feelings should be a sign of strength. Once we break this stigma and people feel comfortable enough to be vulnerable it will be a game changer.
Some great answers so far.
One thought I've had is that as our world gets better and better, we have less reason to have sympathy for ourselves. Particularly here in Australia where life is incredible compared to most other places.
Ultimately, compared to the 100bn people who've lived before us and the 8bn people on the planet today, we are about as lucky as they come... so voicing our struggle doesn't feel right against the backdrop of other struggles.
But surely we need to start viewing our struggles as relative to us. The hardest thing we've been through is the hardest thing we've been through and just because Nelson Mandela spent decades in a prison cell, doesn't mean we don't get to let off some steam about a rough day's work.
We should strive for stoicism but when the pressure gets too much, do we need a way to let off some steam?
I feel like we do.
Love your discussions Ben.
I recently read a book called: If I'm so wonderful, Why am I still single by Susan Page. Written in 1986.
The opening page of chapter one, blew me away. I will type it below....
Introduction
The Great Emotional Depression
Finding Love in an unloving world.
Mother Teresa commented that the United States was the most loveless country she'd ever visited. I won't presume to say what she might have meant, but the statement hit home with me, for I have long experienced this culture as loveless. The West's preoccupation with money and consumerism seems to me far more dominant an influence in our lives than our desire for pleasurable human relationships. We say we seek love and belonging, but we spend far more time and energy acquiring money and the things it buys. Love is an extracurricular activity - relegated to odd moments outside the working day.
The real problem is the extent to which love and work are incompatible activities. Too often, time spent on one is time unavailable to the other. Worse. love and work require opposite types of behaviour. For example, to succeed in the 'marketplace', you have to be competitive, 'businesslike', wary of others, and committed above all else to the bottom line. To succeed in an intimate relationship, you need to be co-operative, flexible, emotionally available, honest and committed above all else to the welfare of your loved one. Such different skills are required for love and work that it is difficult to be good at both of them. And when society values visble affluence as much as ours does, most people are going to spend their energy becoming good at work. Love takes a back seat.....
I don't think the above just applies to romantic relationships and this book isn't just for those who are single. We are so focused on our careers and money (and the rising costs of living do not help with this) that while we care about our friends and family, we often don't have the time to really listen to them.
It's the listening and the validating of the human experience that makes the biggest difference.
Mate, I don't know the solution to the issue, if I did, I would no doubt be very wealthy off the back of that knowledge. But my own experience will hopefully flesh out the encyclopaedia of thoughts, approaches, and accounts you no doubt have offered up to you.
My own issues with depression and struggling in life I only ever discuss once I feel a bit better, when I am a bit lost, I close off and do not talk about it, when I feel better, I start addressing my depression in a bit more of a "review what happened" kind of thing. It is almost like I need to start feeling better before I talk about it, and perhaps that is the tricky bit, how do you dig yourself out of a hole? That will differ for each and every person. For me, I accept that depression will never be completely a non-issue. Although I do feel like I am building a tool set as to how I deal with it and for me it is important that I deal with it quietly, by taking control of my thoughts and forcing myself to get more sleep, get more exercise, drink a little less, and accept that it may be months until I start to feel in control again.
But your approach, is a tool in my approach, I may not engage with your commentary often, but it is still helping, I process my own depression quietly, but still read things like your articles, I still need others being vocal to help reassure myself that the goal is within reach still.
So even if you are doubting your approach, or opinion, you are right, having people talk openly about their struggles, does help those that don't take that approach themselves.
Hi Ben I think it’s a great approach to pose a question. I am not a man (obviously!) but I am a mother of a son. I know whereas my daughter is constantly verbalising about where she is at and how she feels - I observe the conflict in men as they must be strong and so knowing what vulnerability is and validating an emotional state and then to ask for help are often seen as enormous actions. Yes yes keep normalising how you feel or felt and most importantly how you sat with discomfort and what actions or steps - as small as they are - you took. How did it feel. And lastly how are you Ben and what is on your mind? :)
Yes it could be seen/heard as complaining as there is a fine line between a whinge and genuine issue, especially if people don't know the individuals circumstances. Furthermore being reliable is a desirable trait in men and women, especially in a professional environment, so people are reluctant to be seen as otherwise, even if they are actually battling. Plenty of stories of people who took on too much without thinking it through. I think key is trying not to put yourself in a place where you will be out of your depth and vulnerable to unforseen challenges. Of course this not always possible so you still need a confidant you can talk to in the first instance. Talk to through with them and get a fresh perspective. Then decide how best to deal with it. It would be naive, unfortunately, to think society is educated enough at present that one could be so open an honest about struggling without some stigma.
Just throwing in that it’s not only blokes who find it difficult to ask for help or admit that they’re struggling. Many women do too. Anyone who’s ever prided themselves on being strong and resilient (or is perceived as such by others) is more likely to see it as a sign of weakness if they shatter that illusion. Or if you’re the one that everyone else confides in, maybe you feel that you have to be strong all the time to be the ‘rock’ that family and friends depend on. Also, some people just don’t have anyone close enough to confide in and don’t feel comfortable talking to strangers.
Perhaps people need help to identify a request for help, so they don't brush it off: "oh, you're fine!" "Plenty of people worse off than you!" and instead sit with them and actively listen. I think GPs are an under-utilised resource here. They can listen and refer without taking on the emotional element that disclosure to family or close friends could generate.